Dog World news archive - February 2012

Pekingese enthusiasts are making progress

13 Aug 2009 08:02

This article has 25 Comment(s)

PEKINGESE enthusiasts have responded to the challenge set by Kennel Club chairman Ronnie Irving when he told them to set aside personal animosities and start thinking about the future of the breed.
Writing in DOG WORLD two weeks ago, Mr Irving said that various wrangles appeared to be going on in the Pekingese world.
“The KC has repeatedly advised that it cannot and will not involve itself with the allegations and counter allegations about the political goings on in the breed,” he wrote. “Can I please ask all of those who purport to be Pekingese enthusiasts to start to think more about their dogs and less about their personal animosities?”
He said the KC’s decision last year to ‘unilaterally impose’ a new breed Standard for the Pekingese had been taken after ‘many years of effort to get Pekingese people to agree what was required’.

Enough problems


“The Pekingese as a breed already has enough problems on its hands in terms of health and declining popularity,” he wrote. “It is a charming breed and deserves to have a band of enthusiasts which is united in its interest. Pekingese enthusiasts are strongly urged to stop fighting among themselves and to start thinking of the future of their breed.”
At the time Pekingese Club secretary Brenda Oades welcomed Mr Irving’s remarks saying: “The (Pekingese) club has worked hard to try to unite the members by involving them in important decisions and will continue to work for the benefit of the breed.”
Now there appears to be a concerted effort to draw in enthusiasts of all the brachycephalic breeds.
A group called PROGRESS – Pekingese Review Open Group Responding with Evidence-based Science and Sensitivity – is holding an open meeting for the owners of all these breeds but particularly to ensure that the Pekingese survives and thrives ‘in the 21st century’.

One of the group’s co-ordinators, Dr Nicolas Small, said this was good news for the Pekingese breed.
“There is a large silent majority who agree completely with Mr Irving’s letter and want to rise to the challenge,” he said.
The meeting will take place at the Hatherton House Hotel, Stafford (formerly the Quality Inn) ST19 5QP, on Sunday starting at 11.30am and ending no later than 4pm. The first part of the meeting will concentrate on developments that PROGRESS is keen to take forward among them the possibility of gene testing for brachycephalic airways syndrome (BAS).
At 2pm the Pekingese people will be joined by representatives of other brachycephalic breeds – which include French Bulldogs, Pugs, Bulldogs, Boxers, Boston Terriers, Shih Tzus, Bullmastiffs and Griffons Bruxellois – in order to share experiences about their breed Standards.
Penny Rankine-Parsons, secretary of the French Bulldog Club of England, will be giving a keynote speech.
Dr Small explained that PROGRESS was formed in October after the imposition of the new Pekingese Standard by the KC.
“We are a group of Pekingese enthusiasts, breeders and owners who care passionately about the breed and want to develop ideas that are evidence based, in order to inform the next revision of our Standard,” he said.
“We accept that the Standard has to change but want it to be based on scientific evidence – sound genetics and not prejudice. We realise we have a lot to learn from other breeds.”
The aim of the meeting, he said, was to share experiences of dealing with the amended Standards.
“We would also like to see what areas we may have in common including ways we could co-operate collectively to address the concerns being expressed about the head profile in each specific breed Standard,” he said.
“PROGRESS is determined to take up Mr Irving’s challenge and work tirelessly to address the breed’s declining popularity,” he said.
“We are not a political group and are not representing the breed clubs; we are a group of individuals.
“As a breed, do we want to be in the same position as the German Shepherd Dogs who, at the time of writing, have not been allocated CCs for 2012?”

United


This meeting would also provide a chance for people to show how they were united in the interests of the Pekingese, he said.
“This meeting is about the survival of the breed,” continued Dr Small.
“We want people to make the decision to attend and we will demonstrate the ideas we have to ensure the breed can thrive in the 21st century.”
“Our name was chosen to reflect our aims which are to work towards ensuring that the next revision of the Standard is correct for the health of the breed, based on evidence not prejudice, acceptable to breed enthusiasts and in keeping with the history of the breed.
“We are unique within the Pekingese community in that we are not a club or a society and we have a very large database of not only breeders and Pekingese enthusiasts but also pet owners and friends of the breed.
At our last meeting, we decided to see whether we could learn from other breeds about their experiences. We realised that the other brachycephalic breeds have also received adverse attention and so we decided to organise a meeting at which we could celebrate the health of our dogs and share ways in which we can all actively improve it as well as educate others.
“So far we have had a very good response. Everybody in these breeds are welcome to attend. The meeting is free and open to all.
“At this stage we do not know what will happen but we are hoping that we can do some collaborative work as a result of our initial discussions. We are very excited about this prospect.
“An example of this work could be some specific genetic testing on the syndrome known as BAS which can, although only rarely, affect all those in these breeds.
“We would be very interested to hear of any other areas people feel could help different breeds.”
A letter has been sent to all brachycephalic breed clubs.

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    1

    I do hope that all in the Cavalier Breed will also follow the path of the Pekingese Breed. The Cavalier Breed has Two Serious Health problems afflicting it ,MVD and SM. Unfortunately some UK Cavalier Breeders are not heeding the CKCS CLUB's MVD Breeding Guidelines,.50% of Cavaliers will have a Heart Murmur at 5 years of age, it was recently said at the CLUB's AGM ,by the Cardiologist,that this is no better than it was 18 years ago. Also it has been mentioned by a number of Cavalier Breeders ,that they Will Not be Taking Part in the EBV Scheme to help the Future Health Problems of our Cavalier Breed. Bet Hargreaves

    Posted at 09:54 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate

    2

    I am appalled to hear that the cavaliers and Pekinese breeders are not willing to sort out health problems, the kooikerhondje club takes this all so seriously, one because our gene pool is small, we have minimised inbreeding as low as we possibly can. And the 50% of cavaliers that are going to get a heart murmur should all be tested, it should be in club rules that a dog can not be breed from unless tested, but also for SM, the kooikerhonjes have been tested for vWd for 30 years (ish), no kookier in the world should have it but it is still tested for. The KC should enforce that all dogs should be tested before being bred from, and on registering a litter the KC should look to see if the dogs have been tested and if not the litter should not be registered. I hope that these people don’t support animal cruelty, because that is what they are doing.

    Posted at 11:21 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    george | Report as inappropriate

    3

    Also it has been mentioned by a number of Cavalier Breeders ,that they Will Not be Taking Part in the EBV Scheme to help the Future Health Problems of our Cavalier Breed. Bet Hargreaves Mentioned by whom? You!!!I do not believe this. Easy to say, but let's have some proof, Bolshie.You also said Carol Fowler wanted Cavaliers "exterminated" (my word, for want of a better one). This was denied by Mrs Fowler. Who are we to believe? I go for Carol Fowler. Bolshie has shown us all how often she changes her tune. Her postings these days have no real value.

    Posted at 12:44 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    dollytrolly | Report as inappropriate

    4

    Ronnie Irving is quoted as saying: "The Pekingese as a breed already has enough problems on its hands in terms of health and declining popularity,” ---- Actually, when a breed has a serious health problem, declining popularity can be a very good thing. It may weed out the huge mass of breeders who have contributed to accelerating the health problem, and then it enables the tiny corps of dedicated health-conscious breeders to remain and focus on healthful breeding. --- Rod Russell

    Posted at 15:41 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    Rod | Report as inappropriate

    5

    dollytrolly , I will not not be mentioning names ,I was told this information on the Phone by a Cavalier Breeder, No I guess my Postings don't have any value ,I have apologized to the People I have slated in the Past ,Carol, Jemima Harrison, Margaret Carter,Dr C.Rusbridge,I am so ashamed of what I was saying then ,but I was believing at that time what I was spouting, it was all wrong,that I have now since discovered, never about the MVD Problem in our Cavalier Breed,if dollytrolly,if you know anything about me, you will know I have battled for around 20 years about the MVD Cavalier Heart Trouble,the SM Problem was different kettle of fish ,nothing was making sense until my doubts and queries were answered on the new Web Site set up by Dr C Rusbridge, Neurologist. George ,I so agree with your Post, maybe Mandatory Health Tests for the MVD and SM Health Problems in our Cavalier Breed will give Cavaliers the chance of Healthier ,Longer Lives, since some Cavalier Breeders are Dragging their Feet about doing any-thing about it. Bet Hargreaves

    Posted at 15:50 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate

    6

    Bolshie, it is so difficult to make out what you are trying to say. If you took a little more time to compose your posts, put in a full stop once in a while, and went easy on the commas, your postings might have more value because they might actually make sense.

    Posted at 16:43 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    cmsdogsbody | Report as inappropriate

    7

    Sadly, it is a little late notice for me to attend, as I would dearly love to. Well done to PROGRESS for getting it off the ground and I look forward to reading of positive results.

    Posted at 17:36 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    Hazel | Report as inappropriate

    8

    cmsdogsbody, When I got my Highers in English many years ago, this was how I achieved it . Bet Hargreaves.

    Posted at 19:16 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate

    9

    I thought this was an article about Pekes. Why is it that every topic is high jacked by Bolshie and turned into Woe is Cavaliers!

    Posted at 19:19 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    dollytrolly | Report as inappropriate

    10

    It is just because of the serious SM and MVD Health Problems afflicting the Cavalier Breed, that I sure do hope the minds of the Hierachy at the Kennel Club will be focused on them. The UK CKCS CLUB has said recently that the NO 1 Health Priority in the Cavalier Breed is MVD,the Kennel Club has said that MVD is the Biggest Killer in Cavaliers. Bet Hargreaves

    Posted at 19:54 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate

    11

    It's not a new idea but I make no apology for raising it again. -- Make health tests for all issues affecting the breed a prereqisite for any dog wanting to become a Champion. The tests to be conducted within a reasonable time of winning a third CC. The Kennel Club insist that they can't enforce health testing on every breeder but it must be possilbe for them to insist on testing before awarding a title. If the KC adopted this one simple measure they would make champion status a true mark of quality. Breeders could charge a market premium for puppies from tested stock, which in turn would create a market for testing. In time puppies from non-tested stock would be the minority.

    Posted at 20:56 on 13 Aug 2009 by
    convict 225 | Report as inappropriate

    12

    I agree with you convict225, te KC can and do impose testing restrictions on some breed so why not on all? I'm pleased the Peke people seem to be picking up the challenge although it is telling that a separate group had to be set up to try to take things forward rather than the breed clubs picking up the reigns.

    Posted at 07:55 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    mahooli | Report as inappropriate

    13

    I do hope there will be some Cavalier Folk attending this meeting on Sunday. The Cavaliers are a Brachycephalic Breed,and they suffer from a condition ,Syringomyelia. It has been mentioned on other Forums on the Internet that Research has found that Cavaliers' Brain is comparatively large. The Cavalier Breed over the past number of years have now got Skulls which seem to be Smaller and legs that are Shorter ,this is a different Type of Look than about 30 years ago. This is the Popular Look for Cavaliers now-a- days ,but could the appearance of the SM problem in Cavaliers be the result.As I mentioned this might be an ideal meeting for some Cavalier Folk to attend. Bet Hargreaves

    Posted at 09:05 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate

    14

    I believe that in France all Champions are tested before the title is awarded. So, it can be done.

    Posted at 10:30 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    Spotty Muldoon | Report as inappropriate

    15

    Hi Everyone, many thanks for your support. Please, Cavalier people , if any of you wish to attend you are most welcome , im not sure if you where invited, if you where not then im sure it was an oversight. We ALL ( Brachycephalic Breeds) need support and information, so the more breeders that turn up the better. Its time we all presented a united front to address the problems that are connected to our breeds.

    Posted at 13:36 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    Nemesis | Report as inappropriate

    16

    In answer to Convict225. The KC will not back any health screening /test etc unless its their own run in conjunctio with the BVA !The say they do but only verbally. They issued an edict about Irish Setter litters not being registered unless both parents had been tested within their current schemes, so why they cant do the same for all breeds and adopt the health schemes that have been set up is beyond me ! Is is it money ? I doubt it considering they chuck money ate the AHT etc. Any of you tried to get funds fr your schemes from the KC ................ blanc wall !

    Posted at 13:46 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    Nemesis | Report as inappropriate

    17

    Hello everyone I am so delighted with the response to the meetings. The Cavaliers are definitely invited as I have spoken to one of the Coordinators of the PROGRESS group. One of the difficulties of organising a meeting like this, is that people's contact & e mail addresses go out of date. So please do not be offended if you think you should have received an invitation and did not. PROGRESS want to stress again, that all Brachycephalic Breeds are invited and the more people who attend the meeting, the better chance we have of understanding the issues that all of these breeds face. There has been a slight error in the advertisements however as the contact e mail address for the meeting should read coordinator@pekesprogress.co.uk

    Posted at 14:17 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    Cecelia | Report as inappropriate

    18

    The "Progress" Group has been in existence for some time. Thank goodness at last it is gathering support, not solely from Pekingese breeders but also from other breeds with similar problems and objectives. It has been really difficult to be a Pekingese breeder over the past year or so - I hope that finally there is some light at the end of a very dark tunnel. We so much welcome the support of you other breeders and look forward to joining forces with you. We shall then be a grouping to be reckoned with, considering the huge amount of collective wisdom and experience we bring to the table. Amaranth

    Posted at 14:55 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    Sandbug | Report as inappropriate

    19

    Firstly bravo to the peke world and PROGRESS for, well, making such good progress! Facing a problem head on with all the facts that can be gathered is the only way problems can be dealt with. I have a cavalier and a kooiker, both breeds mentioned in above posts. Kooikers have been health tested for 30 years, every dog, religiously. As a result my past kooikers have lived to 14,15 and 16. They are a generally healthy breed, but for anyone that may become complacent they just have to look in the next bench at my cavalier. Once a very good specimen of the breed, now due to NO heart testing whatsoever barely recognisable. I must stress in herself is very happy, but can only walk for half an hour at a time. At just 8 years old its heartbreaking. Health testing is such a low cost for the potential outcome.

    Posted at 15:14 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    claire | Report as inappropriate

    20

    Claire and Cecelia, I do hope that the far seeing Cavalier Folk realize what an opportunity this is for our Cavalier Breed,I know that there are other Cavalier Owners, who fear for the Future of our Breed ,maybe with joining forces with The PROGRESS GROUP,we all can find a way forward in finding some answers for the Health Problems in our different Breeds. Bet Hargreaves

    Posted at 17:57 on 14 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate

    21

    Progress has met with tremendous opposition from the outset. It is heartening to see support for the group and hopefully this support will strengthen. With regard to the health and welfare of the breed, the nettle has to be grasped, and not only by the Pekingese people. Margret

    Posted at 12:52 on 16 Aug 2009 by
    Margret | Report as inappropriate

    22

    I Believe Progress had a very good meeting today , with positive results.Many of The "Flat Faced" breeders Turned up. Funny though that the Opposition in the pekes did not show their faces yet again . Lets hope the Kc sit up and take notice, although i doubt it .

    Posted at 23:59 on 16 Aug 2009 by
    Nemesis | Report as inappropriate

    23

    Well, I was at the afternoon meeting and there was certainly a lot of support for the idea of a brachycephalic breeds group.

    Posted at 18:38 on 17 Aug 2009 by
    Rildey | Report as inappropriate

    24

    Microchip No and a current Veterinary Health certificate for any recognised breed specific health issues including the microchip number for All breeds before the KC awards the CHAMPION title. We can only test for health problems where there is an actual test but if they meet the current criteria then the KC can issue its Champion Cerificate. If the dog is lame on the day of the vets examination perhaps a 3 month maximum period could be allowed forthe condition to right itself. If the dog is never quite sound enough to gain its vets certicate then it will be the winner of 3 Challenge Certicates but never a KC Champion. Lame event horses have to pass the vets examination on the final day before being allowed to compete in 3 day events.

    Posted at 16:57 on 18 Aug 2009 by
    Yorkshireroots | Report as inappropriate

    25

    Could I mention for the Cavalier Breed ,there is simple Health Test to find out if a Cavalier is suffering from MVD Heart Trouble.Surely a Cardiologist can do this, and if the Cavalier is suffering from MVD and is in line for a CC ,then it should be with-held.A Heart Problem is always a Heart Problem. Bet Hargreaves

    Posted at 17:35 on 18 Aug 2009 by
    bolshie | Report as inappropriate